Santosh Ahuja, Lead Engineer at Optum

Santosh Ahuja: The code that Chuck Norris followed in the series Walker the Texas Ranger, you know, he the fact that he was so righteous, he was always honorable, and, and plus he had a bunch of flashy kicks. I was absolutely, drawn, to that person's personality and the role he played.

Pedro Pizzaro: Thank you, Santosh, for joining us today for an interview with us. We really wanted to to get to know you, you know, get get to know a little bit more about your background, maybe advice you have for other developers, and really use this podcast to, as a mindshare, for the community and and to learn a bit more about your background as well and and share that with the world. Right? You know, as you're a lead engineer at Optum, we're just really excited to to hear about your journey and, how you got here, what you're doing, currently, and and where you look to go in the future. So, if you'd like to introduce yourself and maybe a a brief on your background, we can get right into into, talking about it.

Santosh Ahuja: Yeah. So hello. My name is, Santosh Abuja, and I currently work as a lead engineer at Optum, and I've been there for the last 2 years now. I also run my own consulting firm. It's called App Resilience, and, I have a couple of customers, so that's the direction I'm leading into.

My background is predominantly I come from a, you know, business family. I have I completed my bachelor's in, in business and accounting. I did a bunch of courses in computers, right when I was in my 10th grade, but I soon landed a job as an engineer. And then from, there on, there's there's been no looking back, and, I'm here right now in in this country, in this beautiful country, called the United States, where people come to pursue their dreams, where people come to work with the best. And I've also had the fortune of, getting my master's done, at Purdue.

So that's a big background.

John Daniels: Yeah. I'd love to, I myself, you know, I have a a developer background a little bit, and I'm always curious to hear how people got into engineering and development. Sometimes people played with specific toys when they were younger. Sometimes they watched specific TV shows or movies that got them interested. So I'm I'm really curious to kind of hear that beginning, entry into engineering and development.

What was it that got you interested? Was anyone a mentor of yourself, more could we would you be able to dive a little bit more into the beginning stages of your exploration into engineering?

Santosh Ahuja: So it started when I was, you know, you could say young, you know, when you're young, when you're in your teens, you you're really trying to find out you're really trying to find out what you wanna do and carve a path for yourself, but you also have a little bit of that herd mentality. Right? You have a bunch of guys who start playing football and you start playing football with them. They start playing tennis. You start playing tennis with them.

So I had a bunch of friends. They were from, you know, middle class families and they had, their path carved out for them. They had their parents who instilled in them a strong sense of, purpose in their life, education, and get really high paying jobs. I came from a business family and that was not the path for me. I already had a really cushioned, comfortable, and a clear path of taking on my family business.

But, you know, because I had a bunch of friends who had a different path and, I just hung out with them a lot more. And, on one summer and every summer, they would always preoccupy themselves with some sort of a course in order to gather skills that maybe, you know, English speaking course or typewriting course and stuff like that. So that came a summer, I guess, in my 10th grade around when I was 13 or 14. A bunch of my friends enrolled in a computer class. And, really, it's because of them I owe my career to them because it's because of them I I joined that computer class and I really did well.

Never saw computer science as a discipline of engineering, until I saw the amount of math that played an important role, in that, you know, in that in that in that profession. So that's how it started. And then what happened because I did a bunch of courses in computer science. I took up I took up a I took up a degree in business because, you know, my parents want me to, and, you know, we come from a background where we do a lot of things just to please our parents and our family and kinda did that, but also it had a minor in computer science. And I really did well, in that course.

So after that, I, you know, I was still going back and, you know, was with my family, took on the family family business, run it for a while. But at the same time, my passion for computer science and programming grew. I continued to take a bunch of courses just because I was really, really interested in it, just because I had fun solving problems. And it so happened that, I just hung up with a bunch of friends when they were going for an interview, and I just happened to get selected. And, I really took on the job, and I haven't, in this I haven't looked back ever since.

I was still within the same city, so my parents were okay with me going in a different direction for a while, hoping that I would find the going really tough, and I would just come back to the to the comfy life that I that I had. So that's how I got into engineering.

Pedro Pizzaro: That's awesome. That that your path sounds like, you know, you really hung out with a good group of friends, very motivated high schoolers. Mhmm. Very different from from my upbringing of growing up with a bunch of rascals just getting into shenanigans. Right?

You sound like a very motivated, group of folks. Was that I know you've bounced around to a few different countries, and now you're here in the US. Was that back in India? Was that in Canada? Tell us a little bit about your your journey in

Santosh Ahuja: in my career. Back in India. So I did I also had a bunch of friends who who were rascals and I got into all all different kind of shenanigans, but I knew that that kind of thing wouldn't get me too far. So I kind of played a safe role. I had my eggs in different baskets, if you will.

And, and really, and also, you know, because of the sports background, I always had the sense of doing well, have a bunch of friends who I can compete with mentally, physically, and all that all that stuff. So I started back in a small town in India called Kaimatar, and, the short form is Kwendi. It's really known. It's a it's a big hub for educational, for education, a lot of universities out there. And I started with a company, that made software for British Telecom.

It was that was that was the only software company in the city and was really, really, really, really hard to get into, that company. But I started because of my curiosity, I started learning a bunch of courses really fast, and, I started teaching in different universities. That's what I did when I didn't get jobs and I eventually got a gig with them. And, that's how it started. So before it was not until a few years later that I really got a chance to go to Canada to work for some web companies, because I started with a company, you know, who were developing software for British Telecom.

I stayed with the same domain, did a lot of embedded programming, and then soon got attracted to a couple of companies who started doing a lot of VoIP, and voice or IP. And then, that landed me to Canada because Canada had Canada had a lot of up and coming, big, white companies. And some of the companies were really, paving the way for innovation and how, video and audio was being streamed over a call and how all these calls that we traditionally do with COPPA lines were really becoming digital. Right? So I spent quite some time in Canada working there, working for somebody, and that was really an eye opener.

And, because there again, I saw a really, I saw a lot of top engineers. I learned a lot of them, learned learned a lot from them, and that really proved me as a person, as an engineer. I then came back because I was not a permanent position, in Canada. I I was really doing work for an Indian company, but I was engaging with a bunch of innovators in Canada and working in developing some products. And then I came back and, I I was at a point where I was switching jobs again.

And then I worked for a company, that was Venus out of Richardson. And when Richardson was called, Telecom called it out. We do it. Right? A lot of telecom companies in Richardson, like, NCI and there's AT and T over here that is also, you know, Texas Instruments, both hardware in terms of software and things like that.

So, I started working for this company, and then, this company was had the business of a startup, the whole, you know, the whole it was really it was really a technical company at the core. Even the founders were past architects of some really successful startups and things like that. So when I joined this company, they were an exclusive shop of a big up and coming start up. And this start up had and this startup was based out of Richardson and the founders of this startup had senior entrepreneurs. They had, they had a history of building successful products and with multimillion dollar exits, like 100 of 1,000,000 of dollars.

So I got a chance to work pretty early on with such a company. I was core engineer, but then they also had a bunch of engineers here, and I really got a chance to work with some of the really good engineers from companies like Nortel, Cisco, you know, that and that really, again, grew me as a person. It pushed me. I I developed my skills a lot. Pretty much been with the same enough that I was pretty much the same company.

As over the years, this company transformed itself into a full fledged consulting company making software for the web, the mobile, we literally saw an age where, mobile devices, change from mono those monoprint screens to really Apple like large screens with large real estate, and you would really touch on that screen and see things happen. Right? So you got into that smart, smartphone age and, where these our phones really started taking place our traditional desktops. Traditionally, we had desktop. We've installed different apps on them, played different games on them.

Now we're getting into an age where we could do all these things on smartphones. And that's when, this company started making apps, saw the opportunity, started making apps for, a lot of, you know, different kind of smartphones.

John Daniels: Yeah. It's it sounds to me like there's a there's a common thread that kind of weaves its way throughout your life and your career. I'd like to kinda take that road for a second. You talked about when you were younger, and you had this this opportunity to kind of follow the footsteps of your family, which to me, honestly, sounds like a safe route. And I feel like I feel like for those of us who are in technology, we traditionally don't take the safe route.

I think part of being in technology and engineering and development is kind of finding a way to solve a a problem in a different way. You come across an issue and there's there might be a safe route where you can do something, but why not take a different route, especially if that different route leads you in fun and unexpected directions. So you had this opportunity when you were younger to follow in a safe path, but you kind of chose the you you went along with your friends. You you succumb to peer pressure, and you went into the engineering route. And it kinda sounds like you also went that route as you started to get into your career as well.

You you made your way to a small start up where there was a lot more excitement, a lot more risk. There was a lot more what ifs and unknowns. But in the end, it really kind of was the best choice for you, and that kind of stemmed back to your childhood. So in your opinion and, you know, there's there's people out there watching who have this decision all the time. Do they go the safe route?

Do they go the more adventurous route? That's that might be more risky. Do you find that being an engineer in in technology, that is the the better route to go, to be a little bit more daring, to take more risks, you know, not only professionally, but also personally? Is that something that you feel has led you leaps and bounds to where you are now and you'd be in a completely different place if you had gone the safe route?

Santosh Ahuja: Yeah. You know, the answer I think the right answer to that is partly I've I've never been, you know, I've always, you know, I have, I've always been encouraged to take risks, but also the other part is I've always followed my passion and my intuition. So I always have a suggestion saying that never chase money, chase your passion. If you have an intrinsic feeling, that pushes you towards a certain direction, just as long as your intentions are honest, you're honorable in your, in your in your intentions and in your goal, you're you're gonna be fine. So that's what led me to take the decisions that I, that I took.

I always also, there was always a saying that when you join with us, when you join a smaller company, you get a lot more responsibilities. There's a lot of lot more opportunities to take more responsibilities and you kind of mature faster. The other part is also with some of the smaller consulting companies, they're they can't compete with larger companies. They're really jumping on every kind of opportunities that they get. So even if they're, they're risky opportunities and, I've always been someone who's I haven't I've never thought too much.

When I look at an endeavor, I really look at what it offers me in terms of growth. I look at it on the challenges, on the on the challenges that it poses and the opportunities to learn. I don't get in the political side of what if I fail or if I fail, how would I be perceived? What do I look at? Would I make a fool of myself?

That's not something that I really thought. It's okay to fail, but it's important in my view to always take up opportunities and, risks ahead as long as you are honest in your intentions and you're honest to your passion, and you have the will and the determination to succeed, you'll figure out a way. Otherwise, you're you're going to in any ways, if you feel you're going to learn so much that you're gonna be successful afterwards.

Pedro Pizzaro: Yeah. Is is that something that drove you? You spoke about, you know, building your own consulting company and and having a few customers there. Is that the mentality that drove you to creating that consulting company? And you mentioned there's a lot of challenges competing with the big players Yeah.

In the market. I'd love to learn a little bit more about those challenges and and how you've overcome those as

Santosh Ahuja: well. I mean, it's I'm I'm still in in in those challenges because this this the technology space is so big, so wide, and it's growing so much that that's enough for, you know, there's enough for everyone. So that's again why, you know, running my own consulting company gives me an opportunity to choose the projects that I want to work on, work with different people, go to different places and pick up riskier projects and really, win them over and succeed at them. So with bigger companies, because they have so many options, they have the luxury to cherry pick what they wanna pick up and what they don't want to. But then there are some pearls that they often leave out because they think they're too risky.

And that's that's the opportunity that you need to jump on and pick up with both your hands. And, if you do that sooner or later, you'll definitely find success. And I like, and then, and that's how I like this, feeling of really being, you know, independent and being able to work, look at, you know, the whole globe, you know, the whole world as, as the playground and open up my window to all different kind of opportunities and just work on on different things and have that same mentality of taking on risks, pursuing your passion, and doing what what really, what really drives you.

John Daniels: Yeah. That's that's awesome. And to I mean, you started as a a child growing up in India, and then you've made your way to Canada and even Texas. You know? Growing up, could you have imagined yourself where you are today?

And was there any sort of inspiration to go to Canada or inspiration to go to to somewhere like Dallas? Any anybody growing up as a kid that you might have looked up to or or seen as a as a an excitement to to make that type of worldly journey. You know? Because I've grown up in the US my whole life, and I do have goals to travel worldwide, but it's more so travel. But your exciting development journey is taking you to live in all these places.

So taking back a look at your childhood growing up and even into 10th grade when you started to get into it, was there any draw to make your way to either Canada or US and kind of explore this worldly journey along with that development engineering journey?

Santosh Ahuja: So so I'll tell you this that, the lure of moving to the west or travel was never there. I I was pretty westernized in my thoughts and in my, the way I grew up when I was when I was a kid. All my friends, my engineering friends, have ended up in the US and they're really in big positions. But there comes a point that as you get better and better and better and better at your, at your profession, you're always going to be steered in a in a place where the best talents meet, where you can rub your, you know, where you can rub your shoulders and get better. For example, if you really happen to be a great football player, you can play all the local leagues, but as your skill goes, gets better and better and better, you're automatically going to land up in NFL.

That's, that's how I see it. That's how I saw it. There came a point where, we need to the stage and really, rubbing shoulders are the best and working for some really large and big companies. Mobile was the way to go. And really there were a set of events that unfolded that got me here automatically.

Like I didn't even have to really try. It was not like sitting back in India and said, you know what? I'm gonna move to the US or I'm gonna move to Canada. It's just the opportunities, the way they present that themselves. And me being not risk weary and taking everything heads on has landed me here.

Pedro Pizzaro: Yeah. That's that's awesome. And, you know, I know we spoke before this just briefly, but you touched on how, you know, this this is an ongoing journey. This is an ongoing process. You're always out there looking for new information and and, you know, keeping up to date with yourself and your education.

I'd love to know 2 things. You know, what are you doing in that way to to to do the same?

Santosh Ahuja: You know, if you're at heart, you're an engineer. So, you know, you if you if you're an engineer and if you wanna be successful, you've you've committed yourself to a life of, a lifelong learning. So you, you have to understand that. And also I've always, because of maybe because of the background that I come from, I've always had a lot of respect for education. I I feel that the the all these institutions, still instill a bunch of good values.

And also it's more so because what what it does to you in terms of the other people you meet at such institutions, you meet other people who are also are mostly extremely hardworking, driven. They have they have, big dreams and they really wanna change the world and so on and so forth. When you are with with such a group, it's it's, it's inevitable that you will have they'll have a profound impact on you. So it's basically that part that, you know, that that makes, doing a course at one of these big universities so attractive. Otherwise, you know, we're in an age where you can learn by yourself.

You can look at YouTube videos, you can go to Coursera, but also, I've been very picky at where I wanted to study, and pursue my continue my education. And some of the universities that are really in the top 10 or 20 have outstanding, educator educate educationists and professors who know their subject really, really, really, really well. So it's just being among that group, among that highly educated, curious people that, that has a good strong influence on you. It's always been that way right in when I was scared. I've hung up a bunch of engineers and that's how it got me here.

Again, giving when you put yourself among a certain group like that, it's the it's the other people. It's the it's the professors that have a strong influence on on your thought process.

John Daniels: Was there ever a time, you know you've you've been through an amazing journey and and really impressed by it, honestly. Was there ever a time either early in your career where you felt maybe I'm going down the wrong path, or were you always, you know, I'm taking on this challenge, and I wanna see this challenge through completion? Or maybe a time later in your career where you just got so, so frustrated with, the status quo, which it sounds like you probably didn't go down that journey of always doing the status quo. But was there ever a time where you just got so frustrated at something or so unsure about the path that you maybe second guessed? Or have you always been the type of person who says, I'm gonna go on this path.

I'm gonna go to Purdue and finish this degree at Purdue. I'm gonna go to this company and complete this project. Have you always been that type of person?

Pedro Pizzaro: Yeah. And just to add just along those lines, like, how do you know when to quit? You know, if you're so determined to take something through to the end, you know, are is there a time to quit? Is it appropriate to quit at certain times, and and how how do you know when you're on that path?

Santosh Ahuja: So I it's obviously in any careers, you know, there are ups and downs. I saw that the 2,000.com bust, then I saw the white bust. There are depressions. I think everybody who's a professional has, you know, goes through their doubts, their career and even at workplace, you know, sometimes there is bureaucracy and there are other things that really are a definite, are a letdown. Right.

And, there are those feelings that lurk in that says, you know, maybe, you know, I should have taken that at all, maybe I'm in the Olympics, but you as long as you stay true to your passion, true to your course, you have to get your happiness out of that. You have to kinda shun everything else away and see, hey, you took up you went this route because you were passionate about what you were doing. And I think for many people, it's like that. There comes a point when someone's working in a company, there are things that really affect them, mentally and emotionally. But the way they're able to deal with it is to get invested fully in the work that they're doing.

Right. But if you're not, the problem comes, then you made the decision to be here because of money and not because of passion. If it was because of money, then you're gonna say, hey, the money isn't great, and I'm going through this emotional and, you know, mental torture, it's not worth it. So that's why I keep saying the only way to sustain yourself for any endeavor is to be passionate about it. Be passionate about it and enjoy enjoy your craft, enjoy getting better at it, and, that's what, that's what will keep you going.

And I've I've never been a quitter. I've always once I take, because once you once you quit, quitting becomes a habit. And then succeeding unfortunately, succeeding also becomes a habit. So you decide what you want. And it's like you you have one it's it's going back to your sports background.

Right? If you have one bad performance in the season, it kinda leaves an impact on you. It kinda rubs on you. So always end something on a good note, always end something on a positive note, on a positive performance, and keep repeating yourself. And it's okay to fail.

And then there are multiple theories that are saying that you must fail fast or and so on. But as long as you learn from it, you're learning from your mistake, you're eventually gonna succeed.

John Daniels: Wow. Yeah. This this drives me back to as Pedro said, we have spoken before. And this type of line of thinking of grit and drive and determination and not being afraid to fail, it does remind me and I I feel like I would be remiss to not bring it up. When we spoke before, you mentioned that you were a huge Chuck Norris fan.

And when I think of Chuck Norris, I think of drive and grit and determination and never being afraid to to fail. Do you think that either Chuck Norris has influenced your personal life and or vice versa? You've you've were drawn to him because that's how you were personally. And can you kind of dive a little bit in? I I do think it's kind of fascinating how you're a fan of Chuck Norris.

I'd like to get into that just a little bit.

Santosh Ahuja: So as I grew up, you know, I, you know, I grew up as a relatively obese kid, but I I loved action. I loved martial arts a lot. So I took up, I took up martial arts when I was 12. I enrolled in the class of taekwondo, then I went on to represent my state, my country in the sport. Back then, you know, when I when I was in my teens, we started getting, foreign channels and foreign TV content on our on our TVs.

And that's when I I, I followed a series called, Walker, the Texas Ranger. Right. And even before that, I'd seen a couple of movies of Chuck Norris called the force of 1 and things like that. What really drew me, of course, you know, there've been many martial artists and they were all extremely skilled, but because of the code that Chuck Morris followed in the series Walker, the Texas Ranger, you know, the fact that he was so righteous, he was always honorable and and plus he had a bunch of flashy kicks. I was absolutely, drawn to that person's personality and the role he played.

And also his, you know, his sweet southern demeanor is extremely reflective. The kind of, the gentlemanly manners down from the south. And I and I later on, I dug out that he's really from Oklahoma. He's from down south. Right.

He's from Oklahoma, then he moved to Texas. So for many years, you know, I just wanted to be like this guy. I wanted to be righteous. I wanted to be brave, and I wanted to be honorable, and so on and so forth. But I never thought that, I'd land up in Texas.

As I always, you know, said that for me for most of the people, this is Texas. For me, this is Chuck Morris Lane, and that I felt good validation in the world. I have passed, I think, this ranch. It's called, the lone wolf ranch, and it's really inspired from the from what we call, lone wolf McQuade, you know, where he, plays this role and he's his name is McQuade and then he's called Lone Wolf, and he drives drives around an old, self broken, Toyota truck. So so when I arrived here, I got myself a truck.

I still practice martial arts, and I still I still look up to Chuck Norris because I think he's a class act. Even in the world of martial artists, arts, martial arts, he's still extremely respected. I keep wondering why they, you know, why they haven't, gotten him to be a president of this country. I think he's a

John Daniels: Well, if

Santosh Ahuja: he sees

John Daniels: us, who knows? Celebrities are getting into it these days. So Yes.

Pedro Pizzaro: Yeah. And it's it's you. Now you're now you're the Texas Ranger, so it's it's awesome that there's still one roaming around there, active. Right? But I I wanted to bring thing something back to failure, which is, something that obviously Chuck Norris had no part in.

He didn't obviously, Chuck Norris never failed. But but you spoke about failure being acceptable and and really being passionate about the work that you put in and always trying to learn something. That way failure is always an opportunity. Right? And and to always be passionate about something is is really motivating, and that's something that that I always try to relate to and and find success in.

I mean, they're we're gonna have failures throughout our career, and we have to at least benefit from that in some way. You know, tying failure back to bureaucracy, you mentioned, Has there ever been a project throughout your career, something that you've been very passionate about and working, that maybe bureaucracy killed that project? Or, you you know, something got in the way and and it that project wasn't able to come to fruition. And one of the things that I've been thinking about lately is how this is, you know, the pace of AI and technology in that space and how everybody's working on these crazy projects or even cryptocurrencies. Right?

These are projects that, at the end of the day, bureaucracy and or or governments or the law could eventually prevent or stifle innovation in these categories. And I I'd love to know if, you know, if you experience that through your career and working with these companies and what you might think of of people who are passionate and working on these projects, fearing that the same could happen to them.

Santosh Ahuja: Yeah. I think a lot of the times you could find yourself in a project that that is set up to fail even before you enter it. That's possible. But I would again say that in order to, if you know, get into cryptocurrency, get into blockchain or get into AI because that that interests you. Not because there's a lot of money or whatsoever, but let let your passion and your interest be the reason for you to get into it.

Again, bureaucracy and regulation and many other things might be might be a factor in your project, but, it's important to shun all of those away and just be focused at your craft. Just be focused at the task that you have at your hand and make sure you're doing everything in your, power to be to be successful at it. Right. There's only, again, there's only so much you can always control, be focused on what you can change and what, what is in your control and what's not you will when you don't have any control over it, there's no point in worrying about it.

Pedro Pizzaro: That's true. And and and that's how I've kind of reacted to the cryptocurrency. You know, I've been involved in it for a little while. It it wasn't really to make money. Right?

I'm just passionate about the space and the category, and I think, blockchain and these technologies could do good for the world. So, you know, I invest with my time and and my dollars. Unfortunately, some of those dollars have disappeared through the process. But, you know, it's like I'm I'll be okay if if all that money goes to 0. It's really about me trying to push forward the future that that I want to see, you know, for me and and future generations.

So, it's definitely good to to hear you along the same lines.

Santosh Ahuja: Yeah. I'll also add that, you know, you when you're in the technology space, you'll see a lot of that. You'll see a lot of hype. You'll always you'll always be part of you'll always see a lot of buzz, but then you'll have to look at past patterns, look at the history to see how long a particular fad will last. And that's that's the flip side of being in technology.

There is something that will meet its promise and there's there's there's always gonna be a ton of things that won't. And you you have to continuously learn and be wary of that.

John Daniels: Are there any of these future technologies or, I guess, we're now current technologies that you personally have a passion for? You know, we've talked about your your passion and and how it's guided you to where you are now. Are you passionate about AR or VR or crypto or something different? You know, what is your current passion leading you to to to work on these days?

Santosh Ahuja: I'm, so so I'm currently passionate about 2 things, and this has been, and and this has been my, area of study currently. 1 is, semiconductors, manufacturing of chips, how we're pushing the boundaries, out there. How is Moore's law changing and how we're, what are the innovations that are happening that are happening in that space? Purdue is one of the first there's all also recently been the CHIPS Act, in the US that's really pushing forward the manufacture of semiconductors and and chips within the country so that, you know, companies here are self reliant and we can figure out a way to make, manufacture chips here locally. So that's definitely one area.

And Purdue is one of the first, universities to come out with a course that centers around, semiconductors and microelectronics. So I'm doing that as my second specialization. The other one is, of course, artificial intelligence. Right? It's it's I think there came a point where, you know, it became obvious that, data data is the new you know, all companies start saying they still say data is the new currency.

Right? Whoever has more and better control over their data can make faster decisions. And I think AI is, the next step in that direction. To be not acclimated with AI in some way, you know, let alone, you know, master it or know it really well at the core, is just, just being, want to be being ignorant or staying ignorant. So AI, artificial intelligence, because I've already done a lot of work on data, that's a big area of my study.

And the other thing is, since I started my, career as an embedded engineer, the area of semiconductors and, chip manufacturing. Those are my 2 areas where I'm really focused on in terms of learning.

John Daniels: If you could, if you could take a look back at your 10th grade self or current developers who are out there in the world, I think this would be a great place to kind of wrap up with your experience of where you've been, where you're headed. If you could give yourself and other developers out there maybe a quick, you know, a commencement ceremony pitch, you know, or or a, hey, motivational speech, what would you tell your 10th grade self or someone who's just getting started in development about chasing their passions? You know, how would you wrap up how they could kind of mold their growth along what you've done yourself?

Santosh Ahuja: So just to summarize, I'd say, you know, keep the fire up in yourself. Never forget the reason why you were why you chose this field. Always do things that can, you know, bring a change in people's lives and, try to do things differently. Try all always push for, doing things that are innovative. Always try to do things, in a manner that's never been done before, And always, you know, be, be a medium be a medium of change.

Don't be, you know, don't don't be repetitive. Right? You're in a space where there's so much change and so much innovation happening. So, you know, always keep things doing differently and be true to yourself. And, you're gonna that's the only way you're gonna be in this field for a very long time.

John Daniels: Yeah. I think authentic is a good word. I think over the conversations we've had with you, I think you're you're definitely very authentic. And I think I think that's important these days is being authentic to yourself, being authentic with other people. And like you said, you know, chase your passion.

Money will come alongside. You know? So if you chase money, you might not be happy, but if you chase happiness, you probably will find money along the way. So I think that's I think it's a really great wrap up. You know?

And and and I think that's a lesson to be learned, and there were some risks that you took. There were some safe options you coulda had, but you chased your passion in the end, and that really led you to where you are and and that type of wealth. And being able to pass that type of wealth, that type of wisdom and information on to other people It's how we as humanity kind of continue to grow, and that's kind of what Pedro mentioned is that's what he feels cryptocurrency is is helping humanity along this this crazy journey. We're on this crazy journey. What AI is already doing, is very exciting.

And people also forget that for the time being, AI is run by people, and helping other people kind of craft their journeys is pretty exciting.

Santosh Ahuja: And, always have the childlike curiosity. Right? Never let that die. But that's very key that's a unique key to learn.

John Daniels: Awesome, Santosh. It's been great. I think, is there any way that you know, are do you ever mentor people? Are people able to reach out to you, or is there anything that you wanna promote while you're here on at the end of this this, session? You know?

Is there anything that you're working on that you're excited about? Are you willing to teach other people if they reach out

Santosh Ahuja: to you? I've always helped out people who wanted to reach out to me. There are people who often reach out to me saying that, hey. You know, I have these these options. What do I do?

In fact, at Purdue, a lot of people, Purdue, a lot of people that I study with are half my age. So they seek out advices and things like that. And, I tell them sometimes you have to do things to survive, but eventually you want to know what, what, what is, what is it that interests you and just stick to your passion, be true to yourself yourself, and successful definitely follow. That that's what I that's what I have to say. So, yeah, even if my work at Texas yeah.

I think somebody from Texas A&M University reached out and they said, okay. You know, we would want somebody to look at our post grads and things like that. I'm extremely passionate about education. So all also, if there are ways that you can contribute to the, to the society, through your learnings and through your skill, I think we should do that as well. That's that's that's for the betterment of, you know, humanity and mankind.

That's that's the way way to go.

Pedro Pizzaro: Awesome. Sweet. Well, we will wrap it up there. Thanks so much, Santosh, for joining us today. And, yeah, we really appreciate it.